Talk:Angel Falls

Jimmy Angels

What relevance to Angel Falls is "Angel was born in Springfield, Missouri in 1899."? It doesn't even follow on from the preceding sentence. As the information is presented in James Crawford Angel, which is linked to from this page, I have removed it.so this has nothing really to do with waterfalls what so ever LOL.

First sighting

I don't know anything about the first sighting of the Angel Falls, who what when or where. However, it looks like the first sighting has been attributed to a westerner, an assertion that seems impossible. Would it be more correct to say that the first 'Westerner' sighting of the falls was Mr. Sanchez, not that he was the first to see it? It's like saying Columbus discovered the New World.

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I agree. Since we know people have lived in South America for thousands of years, to claim that Angel Falls was "discovered" in the 20th century carries the racist implication that natives of the area were/are not real people (though, I'm sure that was not the author's intention). I personally know almost nothing about Angel Falls, and I may be making an impractical request here, but I would like to see this article expanded to include information about the falls' significance to the peoples who have lived in this region all along. From what I know about places like Niagara Falls and Mount Shasta in the United States, surely Angel Falls must have a larger story.--Atheistlefty 09:06, 15 September 2006 (UTC)

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Something can be discovered more than once. I've removed the word 'first'. --Townmouse 19:27, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

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Pemon Indians I talked with in 1995 said that their people had had no idea about the falls' existence prior to Angel's flight. The nearest village is far down the river which can only be navigated upstream by a motorboat. The Pemon used to avoid tepui plateaus because of cold and dangerous spirits, so they couldn't get to the top of the falls, either. --vdinets —Preceding undated comment added 23:40, 9 January 2010 (UTC).

Salto Angel

Wow.. Near everybody here in Spain would say it was called "El Salto del Angel". --euyyn 14:39, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Jimmy Angel

They aircraft used by Jimmy Angel is described by the article as a 'Flamingo Monoplane' with a link to the DE HAVILLAND DH.95 FLAMINGO. Jimmy Angel made his report of the falls in 1935 but the first prototype of the DH-95 Flamingo was not flown until 1938. The aircraft is also substantially different to that shown in the James Crawford Angel Marshall article which is almost certainly a Ryan Flamingo.

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Just a note about "The waterfall was first base jumped by American Indians in the 1400's." remark. I think that's a) inaccurate b) disgusting to refer to obvious suicide with a flip comment. Recommend it be removed. Just in case: 1400s = no parachutes or personal flying contraptions

Rio Gauja

In World Waterfall Database the river is called Rio Gauja, in other sources also Rio Gauya. Shouldn't it be somehow mentioned in the article? 87.110.159.163 09:32, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

Guiness world records

Can any anyone tell me why the world record information changes every year? my name is cherun and i was born in 1986, my mother found my name in the world record book of that year.The paragraph said that the locals chanted cherun maru over the waterfall, but on this artical it says that the falls connects to the river churun.can anyone tell me which spelling is right?i would be very greatful for any information you may have on the subject in hand. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 86.131.43.111 (talk) 16:19, 8 April 2007 (UTC).
I'm sorry to tell you, but the right spelling is "Churún-merú."

Devils Mouth?

Is it true that the Angel Falls can also be called Devils Mouth??

--219.89.158.219 10:07, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Yes, that's the name the natives use for it. --Andrewire (talk) 10:27, 8 May 2009 (UTC)

freshwater?

Why does the introduction say world's highest free-falling, freshwater waterfall? Is there a higher saltwater fall somewhere? (That's hard to imagine.)

angel future

i have never been to angel falls im just researching it for a fith grade project at scool —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.144.182.152 (talk) 01:01, 18 September 2007 (UTC) Jimmie angels real name was james crawford angel marshall —Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.206.2.80 (talk) 15:51, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

—Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.183.140.61 (talk) 18:46, 18 January 2011 (UTC) 

no there is not it only states it is freshwater so if any younger kids come along to read it for home work they could write it in there homework

External links

I've removed some links from the External links section:

• Article about Jimmie Angel and Angel Falls
• Pemon myths and legends about Angel Falls
• Brief biography of photojournalist Ruth Robertson, pictures of her 1949 expedition to Angel Falls

The first two are blogs and therefore links to be avoided. The last about R. Robinson adds very little information about the waterfalls and is a primary source and therefore can only be used in an article about Robinson herself (perhaps she is notable enough for having an article). JRSP (talk) 20:35, 19 July 2008 (UTC)

Height?

Most sources cite the falls' height as 3212 feet, but that includes cascades and a 100 foot drop that clearly is at least a quarter mile downstream. If that can make it the world's highest, then why do measurements for other waterfalls not include the lengthy talus cascades below them? Angel Falls is only the world's highest single drop with legitimate flow; it is not the highest waterfall. Shannon^talk _contribs ^sign!_:) 03:09, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

no way jose. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 199.104.215.251 (talk) 15:29, 22 October 2009 (UTC)

Water atomized

"The water is atomized by strong winds", any suggestion for another sentence because come on, this is quite crappy. It is only blown into smaller water drops, not in seperate atoms... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.92.80.224 (talk) 21:33, 9 December 2009 (UTC)

According to Merriam-Webster, "atomize" can mean "to reduce to minute particles or to a fine spray" [1] JRSP (talk) 23:15, 9 December 2009 (UTC)

That's correct; to "atomize" is to reduce a liquid to a fine spray. Its generally accepted usage does not imply turning a liquid into separate atoms. Visit a drugstore cosmetic section -- there you'll find "atomizers" which women use to pour perfume into, to spray it on their skin. You think these women are trying to engage a nuclear fission device on their perfume? (lol)
--Atikokan (talk) 23:25, 13 February 2010 (UTC)

Renaming

Venezuela's President Hugo Chavez on Sunday renamed Angel Falls, the world's tallest waterfall, saying it should be called by its indigenous name Kerepakupai Meru.

http://www.reuters.com/article/latestCrisis/idUSN20125231

http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/3181960/Hugo-Chavez-renames-and-reclaims-Angel-Falls

James Michael 1 (talk) 02:34, 21 December 2009 (UTC)

 Disagree. 1. Mister Chavez has no power over Wikipedia. 2. The most common name must be the article name which is in this case clearly Angel Falls.--Westermarck (talk) 12:27, 21 December 2009 (UTC)

If we had a Pemon language wikipedia we would probably use Kerepakupai merú or Parakupa-vena in that wikipedia but the name within english remains Angel Falls.©Geni 14:58, 21 December 2009 (UTC)

AGREE: It is time for the Westerner's to learn the languages names of locations given by the indigenous. In fact their wording gives more meaning to the location than to call it Angel Falls( a typical Christian bigotry name). So yes we should change the name and put into bracket (Angel Falls)just to please the academic Westerners colonial. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.2.117.223 (talk) 15:54, 21 December 2009 (UTC)

Indeed, we should all aim to be as fair-minded you yourself clearly are. For your future reference, a quick read of the actual article will reveal the Falls are named for Jimmie Angel, perhaps the first Westerner to spot them, and therefore the name is about as religious as Smith or Jones Falls could be. Taking reality into account when forming an argument will help you look like less of an anti-Christian bigot. As far as naming privileges go, I say follow the lead of the people of Venezuela. If they do change it, so should Wikipedia. Reaster (talk) 22:20, 24 January 2010 (UTC)

The article records the Pemon name for the falls however english has a long established practice of useing names other than those in the local language. Germany for example.©Geni 17:16, 21 December 2009 (UTC)

I agree English does keep names a lot too. It happens from time to time. It is just a part of life... Some indigenous names are kept others changed. For example Los Angeles was never officially renamed to "The Angels", San Diego was never renamed officially to the "Saint Diego", nor "San Jose" officially as Saint Joseph, etc. The Spanish names have been preserved. CaribDigita (talk) 22:41, 21 December 2009 (UTC)

I agree with you, CaribDigita. But I am sure that a century later or less people will call this waterfall "Kerepakupai merú", not "Angel Falls". James Michael 1 (talk) 03:00, 22 December 2009 (UTC)

A part of me tells me that the indigenous names is very interesting but the reality is that the falls have been known as Angel falls for how long?..over a century maybe? so I think it will be very difficult for people to acknowledge the change, let alone changing it here on the Wikipedia. Victoria Falls is another example of a fall with both indigenous name and anglicized name, Wikipedia currently uses the best known one which is Victoria, of course some redirects should be added though. Thanks--Camilo Sanchez (talk) 00:30, 22 December 2009 (UTC)

Thanks, Camilo. I totally agree with you. James Michael 1 (talk) 03:03, 22 December 2009 (UTC)

The fact that we've had a century of western imperialism and a tradition of aboriginal genocide does NOT justify the use of an anglicized name for a place which already had a name for millenia before the first European saw it. Saying that "Angel Falls" is the name most people use and is therefore acceptable would be like moving "African-American" to "nigger" because that's the name which is most often applied by Wikipedia's pasty white user base. SmashTheState (talk) 01:29, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

The fact is, we're on english wikipedia, and as a reference tool the vast majority of people using this site would be looking for "Angel Falls". That is undisputable. Your comments are petty and only serve to drive more people away from your views. I understand that it may be difficult for you to get this concept but please try. Nefariousski (talk) 18:11, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

I agree that the main name, even in wikipedia, should be the official Kerepakupai merú, with a redirect from Angel Falls. Even if "Angel Falls" is currently more popular with the global (and especially, the Western) reader, Kerepakupai merú is now the official name. (And if less than elegantly stated above, I also agree with SmashTheState's reasoning--the violence of European colonization and "Indian removal" does not need to continue linguistically in the erasure of indigenous naming. Recovering indigenous traditions, languages and names is a noble goal.) Failing that, the politics of the name-change should be discussed in the article itself, not just in the talk page. I took the liberty of adding the information, with English-language references, myself. And by the way, no, Kerepakupay merú was not seen by the U.S.-American aviotor (who, by the way, crashed near there, according to Reuters) until 1933--so, it could not possibly have been called "Angel Falls" for "a whole century." Best, Speed Jackson (talk) 14:45, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

President Chávez already said on December 23rd that there is not going to be a change of the official name. [2][3](Caracas1830 (talk) 21:50, 4 January 2010 (UTC))

Qué lástima. I thought the re-naming was somemthing quite to Chavez's credit. If it was supposed to be a little exaggeration or smear campaign, as the article suggests, it had the opposite effect in my eyes. I added an "according to..." statement to my original edit to make it more precise.Speed Jackson (talk) 23:11, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

Sí, Speed Jackson. Qué lástima. James Michael 1 (talk) 00:39, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Please see WP:COMMONNAME: "Articles are normally titled using the most common English-language name", and as descibed a few lines further down, common usage is of greater significance than official (as noted by an earlier editor, it appears Chavez now has backtracked on the name change, too). Comments like "It is time for the Westerner's to learn the languages names of locations given by the indigenous", "Recovering indigenous traditions, languages and names is a noble goal" (as an argument for the move to Kerepakupai merú), "follow the lead of the people of Venezuela" and indirect comparisons of the words "nigger" and "Angel Falls" are not helpful and provide no evidence that the change follows wiki naming conventions. Note also that even if Angel Falls was as non-neutral as suggested in some of the earlier comments (highly questionable; if visiting the falls, you'll see that even the local companies frequently use the name Angel Falls in their commercials), the naming convention specifically says that "commonality of the name overrides our desire to avoid passing judgment". Consequently, I have reverted the recent move. In addition to going against the naming convention, it is quite clear that it was done without reaching a consensus here, as the most recent comment (on 4 February 2010) is against the move. Considering that Spanish is the main language in Venezuela, it is perhaps also worth mentioning that the article on Spanish wiki is on Salto Ángel (= Angel Falls), and a suggestion of moving it has not been followed, as it – just like here – is against their naming convention. • Rabo³ • 18:46, 6 July 2010 (UTC)

Lmao, is this a pathetic joke? BritishWatcher (talk) 15:33, 10 July 2010 (UTC)

References

Physical Features section

I've looked at some other pages about famous waterfalls such as the Victoria Falls page and they are much more thorough than this page. I recommend taking some information from the summary and expanding it in a new section titled 'Physical Features'. This should be about the geography of the land such as the ecology, terrain etc around the waterfall. Anyone agree? APiggyCalledBobby (talk) 11:57, 25 December 2009 (UTC)

1054 meters

Unsourced information and possibly false, so i put 979 meters back. --Hrotovice (talk) 23:09, 1 July 2010 (UTC)

1054 meters is a physical impossibility, much the same that 979 meters is. I think it's stretching the realm of what should constitute the collective height of this waterfall by including the elevation change over the talus cascades between the main drop, which is unequivocally the highest single drop waterfall on the planet, and the lowest drop given the sheer distance. It feels more justified based on nothing more than the erroneously long held figure established by National Geographic. The issue there is that "measurement" was taken from the shores of the river which the falls feed into. The elevation change from there to the top of the tepui doesn't even allow for the 979 meter figure without making grossly incorrect assumptions about the watercourse which the falls exist on. 2001:569:746F:DD00:39E9:F25:2623:BE7A (talk) 16:38, 15 April 2023 (UTC)

Introduction

Why does the introduction start by saying "Angel Falls or Kerepakupai merú "? Surely this article should say something along the lines of "Angel Falls (native:Kerepakupai merú)..... " . There is no "or" about it. Angel falls is the English language name and the introduction should not try to suggest Kerepakupai merú is a valid English language alternative. BritishWatcher (talk) 16:02, 10 July 2010 (UTC)

That's the basic format we should have, yes. I would suggest not only consistent formatting, but also to use the order given in the infobox (e.g., the common Spanish name should be second). — Gavia immer (talk) 16:19, 10 July 2010 (UTC)

I've changed it to the format I suggested above. Constructive comments are welcome. — Gavia immer (talk) 16:28, 10 July 2010 (UTC)

That looks much better and clearer thankyou. BritishWatcher (talk) 16:38, 10 July 2010 (UTC)

Evaporation

"The height of the fall is so great, that before getting anywhere near the ground, much of the water is evaporated or carried away as fine mist by the strong wind."

This statement is unsourced, and in addition, is unclear. I have a hunch that it refers to the dry season image.Jasper Deng (talk) 03:23, 9 April 2011 (UTC)

Is Kerepakupai Vená indeed the highest waterfall?

I think some of the moulin waterfalls in Greenland might be taller. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.83.235.122 (talk) 03:40, 4 May 2012 (UTC)

Do you have a reliable source for that?--Jasper Deng (talk) 03:44, 4 May 2012 (UTC)

According to Waterfalls of Iceland, there's nothing in Iceland that's anywhere close. Glymur, the tallest of the lot, is only about one-fifth the height of Angel Falls. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 10:56, 4 May 2012 (UTC)

A moulin wouldn't classify itself as a waterfall given it's a temporary phenomenon. Much the same mentions of underwater "waterfalls" in the ocean. I'm not entirely sure how ocean currents which drop over seabeds into trenches, etc are anything of the same variety. 2001:569:746F:DD00:39E9:F25:2623:BE7A (talk) 16:33, 15 April 2023 (UTC)

The Catalan explorer Fèlix Cardona was probably who "discovered" for the west the Angel Falls

Several sources -books and articles to be found in the Felix Cardona article in Wikipedia- credit the discovery of the Angel falls to the explorer and pilot Felix Cardona, who informed about the falls to Jimmie Angel who then was credited as discoverer. I think this should be mentioned in the article. What do you think? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 37.14.78.117 (talk) 09:40, 5 August 2016 (UTC)

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Wiki Education assignment: Research, Writing, and the Production of Knowledge

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